在您生活的国家使用电子身份吗？ 您认为这有哪些优势，或您对此有何担心？
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在葡萄牙居住 5 年后，必须以电子身份证格式更新我的居留许可
Après 5 ans de résidence au Portugal, le renouvellement de ma carte de séjour est dans le format e-ID
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我是一名退休的电脑技术人员和企业主。我可以说，即将到来的一切并不像大多数人被告知和似乎接受的那样良性。__千万不要相信别人告诉我们的关于安全和隐私的一切，一定要运用批判性思维，因为技术正在变得越来越复杂，以至于我们在不知不觉中失去了隐私和自我控制。渐渐地，突然之间，我们就会陷入无从选择的境地。____ 所有社交媒体和大多数信息都受到监控和记录--没有隐私可言。现在，隐私的缺失将被用来控制我们去哪里、允许我们看什么、说什么、允许我们买什么、不允许我们买什么。这听起来像是奥威尔式的，而事实也将如此......____，目前我住在瑞士，但我不必生活在一个拥有数字监控系统的国家。如果这个国家强迫我遵守数字监控环境，我愿意离开这个国家。我不知道那会是什么地方，但我正在考虑各种选择......
I am a retired computer tech and business owner. As since I a fairly good understanding of the technology path we are being led down, I can say that is what is coming is not as benign as most people are told and seem to accept.__NEVER trust everything we are being told about security and privacy, always apply critical thinking as technology is just becoming more sophisticated so that we are losing our privacy and self control without realizing it. Little by little and then all of sudden we are trapped without options. ____All social media and most messaging is monitored and recorded - there is no privacy. The lack of privacy will now be used to control where we go, what we are allowed to see and say, what we are allowed to purchase and what we are not. It sounds Orwellian and it will be...____At this time I am living in Switzerland but I do not have to live in a country with a digital monitoring system. I am willing to leave this country if it forces me to comply with a digital only controlled environment. Where that would be, I do not know but I am looking at options...
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嗨，凯蒂，瑞士也选择了（尽管只差几票）这个在我看来毫无用处的数字身份证，这多么令人难过！我很惊讶 "赞成 "票中有很大一部分来自瑞士国内（德国）。在意大利，起初身份证并不是必不可少的，但不幸的是，现在即使是参加公共比赛或网上求职，也必须要有数字身份证！甚至银行（我想不是所有银行）也要求使用数字身份证。 让我们继续......从 2026 年 5 月起，在意大利，拥有数字身份证将是__不可饶恕的：纸质身份证（纸质格式）将被废除。 __MM的错误，您将在不久的将来付出沉重的 "代价"。__亲切的问候，朱塞佩
Ciao Katy, che dispiacere che anche la Svizzera ha scelto (anche se per pochi voti) questa, secondo me, inutile ID digitale! Sono sorpreso che una alta percentuali di "SI" provenga dalla Svizzera interna (tedesca). In Italia all'inizio ID non era indispensabile, ora purtroppo DEVI avere ID digitale anche per iscriverti ad un concorso pubblico o per fare una domanda di lavoro on line! Anche le banche(non tutte, credo) esigono il digitale. Andiamo avanti e...dal prossimo maggio 2026, in Italia, sarà __OBBLIGATORIO avere l'identità digitale : carta d' identità di carta (formato cartaceo) sarà abolita.__Ecco quello che vi aspetta :( Si, perché non si torna indietro... __MMM errore che "pagherete" caro in un futuro molto vicino. __Cari saluti, Giuseppe
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嗨，Katy,____，对我来说，我有几本护照，这是个有价值的（而且基本上无关紧要的）问题。___国家电子身份证，如果有技术倾向和全球视野，就像粉笔和奶酪一样不同。将匈牙利或中国的电子身份证与芬兰或爱沙尼亚的电子身份证进行比较。____，归根结底，（民主）差异与技术差异关系不大，而与一个国家的公民对其公共机构和代表的信任程度有关。也就是说，公民是否有机会质疑 "他们的 "当局。____ 在网络语言中，推进者们会谈论政府机构/领域之间的 "信任结构"。但归根结底，这种信任取决于我所说的 "双向 "透明度，即如果任何公共机构访问了 "我的东西"，那么它就必须在 "我的东西 "上/中留下交易记录。____，你的同事本（Ben）通过指出爱沙尼亚 X-Road 的 "数据保护驾驶舱"，已经非常明显地说明了公民的这一要求。https://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/digital-democracy/why-a-slow-paced-digital-transition-may-be-best-for-democracy/89992233__（在 "俄罗斯推动提高数据保护意识 "段落下）而且，如果他们发现滥用行为，他们需要一个程序来立即共同做出反应。____，请记住，爱沙尼亚早在上个世纪就有这种想法了。当时，主要是那些信任富国的机构（如瑞士信息中心）将其公民的安全和隐私外包给了微软（主要是）。____！https://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/swiss-politics/political-scientist-sees-mistrust-of-swiss-authorities-after-e-id-vote/90082622____Next 问题，来自任何国家的公民。我有什么好处????"
Hi Katy,____For me, with a few passports, that's a loaded (and largely irrelevant) question.__National e-IDs, if one has a technical bent and global perspective, are as different as chalk and cheese. Compare Hungary's or China's eID to Finland's or Estonia's. ____Ultimately, the (democratic) variations have little to do with technical differences, and everything to do with how much a Nation's citizenry TRUSTS its public institutions and representatives. That is, if citizens have a chance to question "their" authorities. ____In network speak, propeller-heads will talk about the "trust fabric" between government institutions/domains. But ultimately this trust comes down to what I call "two way" transparency, i..e If any public institution accesses MY stuff, then it must leave a record of the transaction on/ in "my stuff". ____Your colleague, Ben, has already made this citizen's requirement quite obvious by pointing at Estonia's X-Road's "data protection cockpit". https://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/digital-democracy/why-a-slow-paced-digital-transition-may-be-best-for-democracy/89992233__(under "Russia spurs greater data protection awareness" para) AND they need a process to respond together and immediately if they find an abuse.____Remember, Estonia were thinking this way back in the last century. Its mainly the trusting rich countries whose institutions (like swissinfo,ch) outsourced their citizen's security and privacy to (mainly) Microsoft at that time. ____Oh look!. This just came in as I was writing. https://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/swiss-politics/political-scientist-sees-mistrust-of-swiss-authorities-after-e-id-vote/90082622____Next question, from any country's citizens. What's in it for me????"
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我看到电子身份证的投票结果神秘地有利于那些决心将民众置于电子身份证束缚中的人。最后的投票结果是 50.4....，谁能想到呢？在我看来......这是被操纵的，我认为他们增加 0.4 只是为了获得优势。不幸的是，我们的西方领导人变得如此刚愎自用，将我们带入了一个科技科幻的世界，我不认为他们会......嗯......作弊。是的，瑞士也是如此！我认为应该重新投票，因为（他们公布的）差额还不足以实施这样的措施。对不起......我不相信他们。
I see that the vote for E-ID mysteriously went in the favor of those determined to put the populace into an E-ID headlock. Isn't it something that the final tally is 50.4....who would have thought. IMHO...it's rigged I think that they added the .4 just to get an edge. Unfortunately, our western leaders have become so headstrong to lead us into a world of tech sci-fi drama that I wouldn't put it past them to...well...cheat. Yes also in Switzerland...!!! I think there should be a revote as the margin (that they published) is not large enough to implement such a measure. Sorry...I don't trust them.
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好在阿根廷开始在2020年使用......你以为你有隐私政府知道absolutamete我们的一切，不说是另一件事的人的私人生活不存在更多......他们知道绝对的一切，如果他们有兴趣的东西或人tr过滤器作为表fe Excel ......是在墙上的一块砖，因为这首歌说......控制我们很长一段时间。他们对每个人的一切都了如指掌......我不知道他们在担心什么，也不知道他们认为自己是自由的......干杯
Bueno en Argentina se empezó a usar en el 2020 ... y vos pensas que tenes privacidad los gobiernos saben absolutamete todo de nosotros que no digan es otra cosa la vida privada de la persona no existe más ... ellos saben absolutamente todo si les interesa algo o alguien tr filtran como una tabla fe Excel ... son un ladrillo en la pared como dice la canción ... nos controlan por mucho tiempo . Los bacos tienen sus bases de datos saben exactamente todo de todos.... No se que les preocupa tanto o se creen libres... saludos
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10 年前，钱包里装有大量瑞士法郎是很常见的事。 如今，几乎每个人都使用塑料钱包、TWINT、谷歌钱包等。 这种轨迹只会朝着一个方向发展。 ____ 我见过印度使用电子身份证的情况，效果非常好。 我还看到瑞典的个人编号是如何帮助个人生活的许多方面与一个唯一的 ID 相联系的，这也使得从银行业务、税收到处方等生活变得更加容易。____One 不应该害怕未来。 最好的办法是拥抱它，并在这一过程中通过解决故障变得更加强大。 没有哪个实施方案是完美无缺的。各国都在争先恐后，减少摩擦，迎接创新。 落后者将面临被淘汰的风险。
10 years ago, it was common to hold a lot of CHF in the wallet. Today, virtually everyone uses plastic, TWINT, Google wallet etc. This trajectory is only headed in one direction. ____I have seen e-Id used in India and it works really well. I have also seen how the Person number in Sweden helps many aspects of a persons life to be linked to one unique id and that also makes llife easier from banking to taxes to prescriptions etc.____One should not be afraid of the future. Best to embrace it and become stronger in the process by fixing the glitches. No implementation will be perfect out of the box. Countries are in a race to move ahead, reduce friction, ambrace innovation. Those who fall behind, risk dropping out altogether.
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@kkckkc
不......不是每个人都使用塑料。我外出时看到很多人使用纸张和硬币......包括我自己。至少 95% 的时间都是这样。不幸的是，许多人往往会无意识地接受官僚们向公众推行的任何东西，然后就会想 "发生了什么事"，因为他们的权利、他们的生存突然被那些只关心权力的人统治了。等着看吧，当你因为碳信用额度超标而无法购买某种商品，或者你已经吃够了这个月的肉，却因为你的电子身份数据而不被允许购买更多的肉时，你就会明白了。这不会有好下场的。
No...not nearly everyone uses plastic. When I'm out I see quite a number of people using paper and coins...myself included. At least 95% of the time. The unfortunate thing is that many people tend to flow mindlessly with whatever the bureaucrats push on the public and then down-the-line wonder "what happened" as their rights, their very existence is suddenly ruled by those who care about nothing but power. Just wait when you can't purchase a certain item because your carbon credit is over the limit or you've eaten enough meat for the month and not allowed to buy more all due to your E-ID data. This won't end well.
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我 100%同意 "ProperD "的观点___我已经写了一篇关于意大利（我住在那里）的评论，但被删掉了！___我问了不发表的原因：我在等待！在意大利，从 2026 年 5 月起，必须拥有数字身份证...
Concordo al 100% con "ProperD".__Ho già scritto un commento inerente l'Italia (ove vivo) ma E' STATO CENSURATO!!__Ho chiesto il motivo della non pubblicazione: sto aspettando.__In Italia da maggio 2026 sarà obbligatorio avere la carta identità digitale...
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有些评论员提到他们的国家使用电子身份系统，但瑞士不是这样的国家。例如，瑞士这样的国家比印度更容易受到黑客攻击和身份盗窃，因为瑞士以富裕著称，人们认为大多数瑞士人都很富有。我百分之百反对电子身份证系统。它只能保证国家当局更有可能侵犯你的隐私。如果他们开始使用 100% 的数字货币，你就可以和你的所有自由说再见了。
There are commenters here mentioning their country using the E-ID system but Switzerland is not that country. For example, a country like Switzerland would be more prone to getting hacked and people's identities stolen than in India as Switzerland is known for wealth and people think that most Swiss residents are wealthy. I'm totally against the E-ID system 10000%. It guarantees nothing but the ability for governmental authorities to invade your privacy even more. And if they start with 100% digital money you can kiss ALL your freedoms goodbye.
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@ProperD
我完全同意你的观点。电子身份证也是一个非常有吸引力的工具，可以秘密监视人们及其生活习惯。该系统收集的信息也可能对国家未来的重要管理决策有用，但可能永远不会有人告诉我们这一点。
Condivido pienamente la sua opinione. La E-ID è uno strumento molto attrattivo anche per spiare di nascosto le persone e le loro abitudini. Le informazioni raccolte in questo sistema potranno anche tornare utili per prendere importanti decisioni future nell'ambito della gestione del paese ma questo, probabilmente, non ce lo dirà mai nessuno.
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在几内亚这样的国家，一旦停电，所有通信网络都会中断，特别是数字身份证会因欺诈和盗窃而完全失效。
Dans mon pays comme la Guinée quand les pannes générales surviennent suite à des coupures électriques, il y aura le dysfonctionnement de tous les réseaux de communication en particulier la carte numérique ID sera complètement bloquée de ligne faute à des raisons d'escroqueries et vol .Malgré certains efforts mené par les différentes institutions bancaires, la population guineenne rencontre des sérieux problèmes pour le retrait de leurs agents à la banque
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非常感谢你的贡献。希望您有机会避免可能造成的损失。
Merci pour cette belle contribution de votre part, j'espère que vous avez eu la possibilité d'éviter d'éventuel dégâts.
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在西班牙等地，如果出现大面积故障，IN 卡就会失效。只要一个连接问题，你就会被卡住。我曾不止一次遇到过这样的情况，一些持有数字机票的旅客，不是网络出了问题，就是电池出了问题。将一切物质化让我们完全依赖他人，这让我们失去了无数自由。
Lorsque des pannes générales surviennent comme en Espagne par exemple, une carte IN ne fonctionne pas. Un problème de connexion et on se retrouve coincé. Je l'ai constaté plus d'une fois avec des voyageurs qui ont des billets d'avion numériques et qui ont soit des problèmes de réseau, soit de batterie. Tout matérialiser nous rend entièrement dépendants, c'est une énième perte de liberté.
SWI SWISSINFO.CH
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@JoanBoa
感谢您的贡献！在断电的情况下使用电子身份证确实有困难...
Merci de votre contribution! Effectivement, en cas de panne de courant, il peut devenir difficile d'utiliser une e-ID...
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在我工作过的东非或印度，数字服务无疑是合理的。如果邮局和行政部门不可靠，自动取款机和银行分行在大片地区不存在，那么手机上的数字身份证就是唯一的选择。如果普通公民没有存款，那么网络盗窃钱财就不是问题。但瑞士的情况完全不同。
In East Africa, where I also worked, or India, digital services have merit. When post offices and administration are not reliable, ATMs and bank branches don't exist in large areas, then a digital ID on a mobile phone is the only alternative. Cyber-theft of money is not a problem where an average citizen has no savings. However, Switzerland is a completely opposite case.
SWI SWISSINFO.CH
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@Jorg Hiker
感谢您的精彩发言！您认为瑞士不应该有电子身份识别系统吗？
Merci de votre intéressante contribution! Estimez-vous que la Suisse ne devrait dès lors pas avoir d'identité électronique
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@Katy Romy
我认为，电子身份证没有必要。公民将无法验证安全性和隐私性。没有讨论国外存在的问题，从悄然兴起的大规模监控到政客斥责电子投票结果被操纵。没有为瑞士人民带来巨大利益的具体案例。取而代之的是 "瑞士在数字化方面落后了 "的论调，这无异于从众心理。与数字天气和数字地图的比较表明，该计划为许多国家和商业利益开放了电子身份证。讨论中遗漏了太多重要内容。甚至没有计算纳税人在建立和维护电子身份证方面的成本。这不是一个廉价的系统。
In my opinion, e-ID is not needed. Citizens themselves will be unable to verify safety and privacy. No discussion of problems abroad, from creeping mass surveillance to politicians rejecting results of e-votes as manipulated. No concrete cases of wide benefit to people in Switzerland. Instead an argument 'Swiss fall behind on digitalization' that equals herd mentality. Comparison with digital weather and digital maps shows that the plan is opening the e-ID to many government and commercial interests. The discussion omitted too many important issues. There is not even the calculation of the cost of setting and maintaining e-IDs to taxpayers. It is not a cheap system.
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@Jorg Hiker
@Katy Romy...你说得一针见血...尤其是关于 "从众本能 "的部分。瑞士总是习惯于看看别人在做什么，然后得出结论：瑞士也应该这样做....。同样有趣的是，西方国家想鼓吹一切 "E"，如电动汽车，但却没有能力支持它们，也不坦诚它们对环境的危害。
@Katy Romy...You Nailed It...especially the part about "herd mentality." Switzerland has a habit of checking what everyone else is doing then come to the conclusion that Switzerland should do it too.. It's also funny how western countries want to push "E" everything like electric cars but yet don't have the capacity to sustain them nor are they being honest about the dangers to the environment.
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数字身份证是片面的--数据被盗的成本主要由公民承担，但行政部门却能从中获益，比如更便宜的用户验证。数字身份证基于一个根本错误的假设：IT 系统从根本上是安全的。但事实并非如此。数据盗窃非常普遍，大多数个人数据都是被盗的。然而，这一概念是建立在错误假设的基础上的，即这种情况很少发生，可以忽略不计。在我工作过的波兰，一种常见的骗局是利用窃取的个人数据以他人名义购买信贷或汽车保险。在银行要求受害人归还未取走的钱款或其账户被扣押人冻结之前，受害人对此毫无察觉。在实践中，受害者被迫证明自己的清白，有时他们的银行账户会被冻结数周，或前往遥远的城市参加庭审。多年来，人们已经认识到这一点，但法院仍然经常认为欺诈是一种有效的义务。数字身份证使身份盗窃的可能性增加了许多倍。在其他方法无法奏效的偏远国家，数字身份证可能有意义，但在瑞士却没有意义。
The digital ID is one sided - the cost of data theft falls disproportionately on the citizens, but the administration gets benefits like cheaper verification of users. __.__Digital ID is based on a fundamentally false assumption: that IT systems are fundamentally secure. They are not. Data theft is so common that most personal data get stolen. , but the concept is based on a false assumption they are rare and can be neglected. __.__A common scam in Poland where I worked is using stolen personal data to get credit or car insurance on somebody else name. A victim knows nothing until he receives demands from a bank to return money he didn't take, or his bank account is frozen by a repossession man. A person, in practice, is forced to prove own innocence, sometimes having his bank account frozen for weeks or being forced to travel for court hearings to a distant city. It has been known for years but courts still regularly take the view that scams are valid obligations. A digital ID increases potential for the crime of identity theft exponentially. __.__A digital ID may have merit in remote countries where other methods don't work, not in Switzerland.
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@Jorg Hiker
我完全同意这一点，但遗憾的是，根据最新的民意调查，9 月 28 日的投票将不可避免地支持引入电子身份证。
Condivido pienamente ma, purtroppo, secondo i sondaggi più recenti, la votazione del 28 settembre è destinata ad avere un esito favorevole all'introduzione dell'E-ID.
以下评论已自动从IT翻译成中文。
大家早上好！__这是个大骗局，比如在意大利，从 2026 年（8 月）起，你必须拥有数字身份证！例如，如果您需要访问您的个人社会保险档案，您需要一个数字身份，当涉及到更多的安全性时，那是没有用的！___不幸的是，意大利是一个没有诚信或特定规则的国家，没有人知道我们的数据是谁的，去了哪里！___在瑞士，一个联邦民主国家，情况可能会好一些。如果发生大流行病/紧急状况，如果你需要服用的疫苗没有标签，你就不会 "死"，也许连制药公司也会用数字系统锁定你，我不会让你去看下一个你需要去的医生。还记得 "臭名昭著 "的绿色护照吗？它来了....，数字格式。__"如果你破坏了银行，或者不同意，好吧，那我就封锁数字系统，让所有人都闭嘴，让它倾斜90度。"__好心没好报。__亲爱的瑞士朋友们，对数字系统投反对票，远离它！这仅仅是个开始。
Buongiorno a tutti!__E' un grande inganno, per esempio in Italia dal 2026 (agosto) sarà OBBLIGATORIO fare la carta identità digitale! Niente più cartacea.__Se devi accedere al tuo fascicolo personale della previdenza sociale, per esempio,__ci vuole l'identità digitale, non serve a nulla in termini di sicurezza maggiore!__Purtroppo l'Italia è un paese senza onestà ne regole certe, nessuno sa con certezza chi e dove vanno i nostri dati!__Forse in Svizzera, essendo un paese democratico federale, la situazione magari può essere migliore .__Si, anche il fascicolo sanitario è digitale in Italia, ok comodo, ma chi può "vederlo"?__Se c'è una pandemia/emergenza magari anche le case farmaceutiche, magari se non è segnato il vaccino che devi fare per non "morire" ti blocco con il sistema digitale, non ti faccio fare la prossima visita medica che devi fare. __Ricordate il "famigerato" green pass? Eccolo arrivverà....in formato digitale.__"E se rompete le scatole o non siete d'accordo, beh blocco il digitale, farò stare zitti__tutti e inclinati a 90° gradi "__A buon intenditor poche parole.__Cari amici della Svizzera VOTATE NO al digitale, state lontani! E' solo l'inizio.__Ciao un abbraccio.
以下评论已自动从IT翻译成中文。
如果能以民主的方式使用电子身份证，那将是一件非常好的事情。
e-ID cosa ottima se usato democraticamente.
以下评论已自动从EN翻译成中文。
@Dario Oliana
而电子身份证则让摧毁民主变得更加容易。各国政府都在测试他们能在多大程度上摆脱电子监控。从中国的社会信用到 2022 年加拿大对抗议者银行账户的封锁，再到英国的面部识别雪崩。这不再只是 "哦，你为什么不相信我们 "这种理论上的可能性！
And e-ID makes destroying democracy much easier. Governments test how much electronic tracking they can get away with. From Chinese social credits, through Canada blocking bank accounts of protesters in 2022 to United Kingdom avalanche of facial recognition. This is no longer a theoretical possibility of a sort 'oh why you don't trust us'!
以下评论已自动从EN翻译成中文。
O,K、
O,K,
以下评论已自动从IT翻译成中文。
我住在意大利。___首先，我是残疾人，使用手机有问题。___其次，我对这些创新为如此私人的东西提供的安全性没有十足的信心。
Vivo in Italia. Abbiamo il fascicolo sanitario elettronico ed è molto comodo.__La carta di identità è fisica.__Personalmente non mi andrebbe fosse digitale.__In primis son disabile ed ho i miei problemi a gestire il telefonino.__Secondo non ho fiducia totale nella sicurezza che danno queste novità su qualcosa così di personale.__Io ho già votato per un NO.
以下评论已自动从EN翻译成中文。
我的新印尼居留证相当于一张电子身份证。我不必再去移民局。电子居留证就足够了。
My latest Indonesian residence permit is equal to an electric ID card. I do not need to visit the Immigration Office any more. The e-Residence Permit is sufficient.
以下评论已自动从FR翻译成中文。
不必过分担心系统的安全性 每周都有大公司遭到黑客攻击 你的姓 名字 出生日期 邮寄地址 电话号码，可能还有你的信用卡都已经在互联网上___最后，我们笑一笑，我在谷歌上搜索联邦顾问，我的邮箱里充斥着各种广告 如何在 7 天内成为联邦总统
Il est inutile de s’inquiéter outre mesure de la sécurité du système chaque semaine de grandes entreprises se font hacker votre nom prénom date de naissance adresse postale numéro de téléphone et probablement vos cartes bancaires se promènent déjà sur le web__Et pour finir rions un peu je fais une recherche sur Google en tapant conseiller federal et ma boite mail est inondée de publicités comment devenir président de la confédération en 7 jours
以下评论已自动从EN翻译成中文。
@Jean rime
没错。我在印度尼西亚的妻子刚刚接到一个假冒的所谓税务官员的电话，他们用她的真名向她打招呼。 (但税务局已经警告过不要打这种假电话）。 这算是进步吗？是进步，但对谁来说呢？
Exactly. My wife in Indonesia just got a phone call from fake supposed to be Tax Officials, who greeted her with the correct name. (but the Tax Office already warned of such fake calls). Ah well, is this calle progress? Progress yes, but for whom
以下评论已自动从EN翻译成中文。
@Jean rime
黑客攻击总是时有发生，但数据合并使黑客攻击变得更加危险和痛苦。特别是因为电子身份证包含的生物识别数据无法像被盗的密码一样被替换。
Hacking always occurs, but bringing data together makes hacking so much more dangerous and painful. Especially that e-ID has biometrical data which you cannot replace like a stolen PIN.
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